Hardly a week ago, we were presented with yet another Wii specs rumour, which most notably Ars Technica tried to debunk in the meantime. Their conclusion was that either:
1. The MaxConsole specs are someone's idea of a joke.
2. The Wii really is just an overclocked GameCube with a DVD player, in which case the joke's on Nintendo.
The latter option is hardly believable, it should be added, considering that Nintendo, IBM and ATI spent years and millions on the development of the hardware. The specs, most people agreed, must be fake.
Now, it seems that the rumourmonger who spread them is a wee bit on the sensitive side. In an update to the original MaxConsole story, he is said to be "shocked to see all these cries of 'fake'." So, in an effort to restore his unnamed name, he dishes some more dirt:
Broadway is Wii's CPU. Broadway functionality and specifications are as follows.
• Operating speed: 729 MHz
• Bus to main memory: 243 MHz, 64 bits (maximum bandwidth: 1.9 gigabytes/sec)
• 32-kilobyte 8-way set-associative L1 instruction cache
• 32-kilobyte 8-way set-associative L1 data cache (can set up 16-kilobyte data scratch pad) (...)
Hollywood is a system LSI composed of a GPU and internal main memory (MEM1). Hollywood is clocked at 243 MHz. Its internal memory consists of 3 megabytes of embedded graphics memory and 24 megabytes of high speed main memory. (...)
Wii uses 64 megabytes of GDDR3 (MEM2) as external main memory. Like internal main memory, MEM2 can be accessed directly from Broadway and the GPU at high speed and has a peak bandwidth of 4 gigabytes/sec.
Now, the entire list is very long and it gets very, very technical by the looks of it. However, our dear Mr. X is going to be even more upset to find that a great deal of punters still don´t believe him. The good people over at the MozLaPunk boards, for example, are questioning some of the memory specifications:
Using GDDR3? Why would they do this when we know they have access to MoSys's 1T-sram?Our dear anonymous friend will be even more upset now. I won´t comment on this story, because I really don´t have a Ph.D. in electronics. I´ll leave that up to you guys.
Source: MaxConsole, Ars Technica, MozLaPunk boards
39 comments:
I dont even bother to comment on these specs that always get released. Whoops too late.
I didnt pay any attention to the last week or so's one and I dont see much reason in looking further. The system is close enough to not waste any time trying to debunk someones spec sheet.
Either way I dont see why he should be surprised that people dont believe him, even if it were indeed the true specs there are that many fake spec releases out there that why would anyone choose to believe.
Well, it's confirmed Wii uses 1T-sram, so GDDR3 is nonsense.
DarklinG_NL
Hi DarklinG_NL.
Is that really so? Does the combination of 1T-SRAM and GDDR3 really make no sense? Is it, simply put, that the former is an advance on the latter?
I think its not even neccessary
discussing specs when a picture tells more than 1000 words could!
Look at the games.
Which game is the most sophisticated on Wii so far?
Eventually Mario Galaxy.
If one were to compare Mario Galaxy with Mario Sunshine where are the improvements?
First of all lightning !
Its visible that Wii can handle more and better lightning than GameCube in titles like MG,MP3,RayMan etc.
The textures are more consistent than on GameCube which means that there must be more memory in Wii to pull it off.When you go up close to a wall in Metroid Prime for GameCube the textures get blurry but on MP Wii they maintain the quality.
The polygon count in Mario Galaxy seems to be quite a bit higher than in Mario Sunshine which becomes pretty evident when watching the robot-scene in Galaxy.The robot screws and holes where it shoots the rockets are well modelled and remain round even when Mario is close to them.
However all in all I would say from what we have seen so far the improvements still are pretty subtle which leads me to the conclusion that those specs cant be that off the mark.
Wii has been given a lightning boost,more memory for more consistent textures,and maybe twice the rendering power of GameCube if the games are any indication.
I have to say although its "all
about the controller" I was still expecting a tad more of Nintendos console as far as visuals are concerned!
I mean one needs to look no further than Red Steel to see the reality.
IGN has released quite a bunch of screens which are supposed to showcase the improvements they have made ever since E3,but notice how they are still way under the standard they had envisioned with the first screens they showed from a PC prototype version?
I think its safe to say that a Gears of War,MGS,BioShock,Asassins Creed,Crysis etc. standard is quite unrealistic unless Capcom goes back to the drawing board with the Resi 4 engine and cancels any sort of paid vacation for its employee for the next two years :)
Well the memory makes sense to me, remember current RAM chips need power to retain their data. The MoSys 1T-sram is meant to be a low power operation memory (as to allow Wii Connect 24) and when a game is about to start up the system will kick in its GDDR3 (the same memory used in high end video cards). I don’t see this as being to difficult to believe, the 729 MHz CPU rumor started back in March from IGN, who claims they got it from a “reliable inside source”. This also goes with Nintendo’s current methodology; with an emphasis on power-efficiency.
Why are people so upset by these specs? Nintendo said all along that the Wii will not have a lot of horse power, which was never the goal for Wii.
They are upset because they expected a bit better.
Sorry that this is off topic, but I was wondering what you thought about the recent news of Nintendo and Microsoft being sued over patents.
As far as I can tell, Anascape Ltd. (Company suing) is several people at the most. It does not have an internet presence (Google results turn articles on the patent dispute and entries from the US patent office) and doesn't seem to produce/sell products or services. I don’t think that this will go to far, but I wanted to know what you thought.
As far as the specs go, I call fake. It is kind of clever that they included really detailed stuff - it makes it seem like they know what they are talking about.
Hi I-Ninja.
I answered your and Carmine´s questions in the comments to the post before last. Here´s what I wrote:
Hey Falafelkid, what is up with the Star Wars Wii game you promised before E3? Is it going to be revealed at LGC?
I don´t know. I only received exclusive and confidential information that this game was in development (that was in May). It was my own assumption that it would be shown (with everyone associating the Wiimote with Star Wars).
I have made my LucasArts appointments for GC but I have, in all honesty, not learned of anything regarding this title.
Hi Carmine.
I'm thinking that the "lightsaber game " just might've been that Heroes trailer (NOT star wars, but the trailer of the game by Grasshopper STudios that TheWiire leaked, and then pulled a while ago).
No, you´re wrong on this one. See above. It was my own assumption to expect it at Nintendo´s pre-E3 show.
Again, I know this: There is a Star Wars game in development for Wii that focusses on lightsaber action.
I have no idea when it will be shown or when it will be ready.
Will Nintendo show updated demos at GC?
Hi Anonym.
Will Nintendo show updated demos at GC?
I am afraid I cannot say anything at this point. I expect there won´t be any announcement before the actual press conference (it´s not a keynote by the way, there are none at GC). So you will just have to wait until GC. Sorry.
How do publishers approach GC ?
Hi Anonymous.
How do publishers approach GC ?
What do you mean? How they value it? It´s Europe´s most important expo. They´re all attending, literally.
Why isn't GC taking place in a major city like munich where international exhibition like ISPO take place and where the fair grounds are a good deal bigger?
exhibitions
Which games do you look forward to most on Wii?
Can we expect titles where the controller acts as a pointer like for example in Lucasarts adventures or strategy games ?
Do you think Nintendo lacks the hip image Sony has solely because of the name or also because of games like Pokemon,Kirby,Yoshi,Nintendogs etc.?
Do you think Nintendo targets mature audiences at all?
WarioWare and Wii sports hardly sound attractive for casual UK Wipeout,Final Fantasy,Winning Eleven mid twenty coevals.
Has Nintendo NCL released one single mature rated title to date with the great gameplay they are famous for?
Could it be that Nintendo deliberately targets kids with its games even if they dont admit it since they always capitalized on it with games like Donkey Kong and Mario?
Does Nintendo in all honesty think
that they can angle PC and PS2 gamers and adult nongamers with
Wii Sports and Mario Galaxy ?
Will Nintendo introduce significant new IPs for Wii in forseeable future?
Is Falafelkid busy with Jessica Chobot?
:)
Games Convention in Munich... Now THAT would be awesome! But i'm afraid, IF the GC goes anywhere, then Berlin. They already tried, to get the Expo ther!
I hate to break this to you Falafel but I wouldn't trust the gaggle of 12 year old kids that swarm the Mozlapunk forums either. Ars Technica, on the other hand, knows it's stuff. If the Ars Technica guy beleives it's fake, it's good enough for me.
If those specs were provided by a Wii developer, then i asume those specs comes from the dev-kits Nintendo delivered to third-parties a few time ago. Anyway, if those specs can really deliver the graphics we hve already seen at E3, then they're fine for me. Wii is about gameplay, not about graphics.
PS: who is anonym? the one that wrote a lot about Nintendo just targeting kids and stuff?? Maybe he should show his face....
Remember Eternal Darkness? Nintendo had a lot to do with it.
Nintendo doesnt make games just for kids some people have a different idea of what mature is im guessing for some gamers they think that just because it has blood etc that its mature...
Anyway they are just trying to target a wider audience not just kids, they want many people to play their games.
And whats wrong with that? with so many games being made for age 16-above
it seems only Nintendo is giving games that kids can pick up without someone like Jack thompson appearing to attack the gaming industry. are you "mature" gamers so selfish that you dont think about others? i for one salute Nintendo for being one of the few devs that makes games that everybody can play and enjoy:) thank you .
/MFEO
Lord Darcia, including third party support the number of known full titles for the wii launch is currently at 33. Nintendos is "supposedly" going to unveil 5 new launch titles at Lezpig. That sounds ridiculous to me but the last time that Matt C. of IGN said that, it turned out to be true. Even if it's not, you already have have 30+ full blown titles landing in the launch month, none of which are VC titles. That's the largest console launch that I know of. I think it's been speculated that the VC will launch with ~20 games including third party offerings but noone really knows for sure. I don't think it would really be that hard for Nintendo to have their entire nes and snes library ready from the getgo but I think they would probably stagger the release of titles in order to rake in as much cash as possible over the console's life span.
As for wanting to tie the success of the most successful gaming hardware on the planet to their new product, I think they'd be extremely stupid not to. Nintendo wants it's buyers to feel assured that the Wii will succeed just as the DS did. And the people do thinks to the constant DS referencing by Nintendo representatives. And if the people identify the DS with the WII then publisher will. And publishers have. If they can develop a title on the wii for 1/2 the price of an equivalent ps3/360 title with a lesser development time they only have to sell half as many units on the Nintendo system to turn more profit.
As for showing it's age, just look at the 3DO, turbographix, phillips cdi, sega cd/32x/saturn/dreamcast, jaguar, ect. He who ends up with the MOST games is the winner. Quantity wins over quality every time. The machine that ends up with the highest adoption rate is all that matters, not what the games look like. Not who has the best games. The 360 has seen a slower adoption rate than the original xbox had, that's not a good thing. Especially since it's slowing down. And with people preferring the 360 to the PS3 that even bodes worse for the industry. As a matter of fact, outside of the DS, the entire industry is floundering. I think it's hard to argue that it's not a good time to be Nintendo. The reason is simple, if it has a moderate rate of adoption then it will drain MOST of the development resources from the 360 and the PS3 third party developers over the course of the next two years.
..dear Lord.
I've more or less some proof that Wii, graphically will be very close to what Xbox 360 has. The power of 360 and for that matter even PS3’s, will used for rendering heavy texture maps including HDR. Now, the design of Wii system will have the capability to either used SD or HD. But due to business related factors, Nintendo have opt for an SD system but with the ability of rendering “animations” in real-time! As stated in one of their patents they have successfully developed a game system that will let gamers interact with a game visuals people used to call – cut scenes. This technology have been development since the introduction of the Radeon 9700 cards. And have been I every pc system that use this card and those above it. Now this technology does does not belong to ATI only I’m afraid. This means that Nvidia also possed this kind of technology.
That means that all 3 nextGen have similar base of technology. But the differences that separates them apart lies in their respectively grows strategy. Microsoft has HD and focusing on stabilize their market chare whilst try expanding it using this generation of gaming as compass. Sony’s strategy is to crush their competitor into submit with their mighty multi++ cores technology. Whiles Nintendo seemingly unnoticeable have laid out grows mastermind strategy based on layerings that probably spawn 10 years into future at least. This by developing a two type of system (wii) based on Xxxx ATI card that have the option of turning this generation wii into HD or the generation there after. We usually call it – future proof right?
But what’s revolution is really in this: Wii is an emulation application. This application will let you, if preferred, be loaded into your computer or any for that matter. And as an emulator it will have the advantage to use the hardware resources made possible by its host computer.
…now imagine that this computer “accidentally” to have the most advance GPU on the pc market anyman can buy. Wouldn’t you think that developers will utilize this option? And again, as stated in a patent filed by Nintendo, this kind of system if programmed correctly will utilize its host powers very efficiently.
Now, let think again. Wouldn’t you call this kind of strategy an – revolution?
Sounds like the previous poster is talking about FMV, oh joy..... Finally, Night Trap 2 will hit the Wii.....This kid spends a lot of time in la la land and apparently wasn't around in the early nineties. Someone buy this kid a sega-cd.
Seriously, don't be a @#$@#@#$ moron, the reason the Wii doesn't cost 800 bucks is because it won't be able to match the other two, even remotely, when it comes to graphics. You have to remember that Microsoft and Sony are losing money on their systems from the get go. Nintento will be turning profit. If the wii had been released by Sony or Microsoft, it would run for ~100 bucks.
In this race, supporting Nintendo is like supporting you local Indie music store or the mom and pop's coffee shop. You pay more for what you get but you get quality from people who seem to really care about what they are doing.
Hi Lord_Darcia.
Thanks for your interesting comments. I disagree with a few points you made (and agree with some parts of Anonymous´ reply). I´ll just pick out the main points.
I know many people will be tempted to use the: "xbox vs ps2 argument, where ps2 is slightly inferior in terms of graphics (...)
Now, the PS2 is greatly inferior to both GameCube and Xbox. That´s not up for discussion. So the argument is stronger than you might think.
Besides super mario galaxy, zelda, and metroid prime 3, Red Steel did you notice any other software that made you want to go: HOLY SHIT I WANT TO BUY NINTENDO WII NOWWWW! Not really.
Oh lord, yes! Heroes (big time, seen the trailer?), Wii: Sports, Project H.A.M.M.E.R., Rayman Raving Rabbids, Call of Duty 3, Tony Hawk´s Downhill Jam, definitely Trauma Center (loved the DS version), Disaster: Day of Crisis, ExciteTruck, WarioWare, Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz, WariWare and Cooking Mama.
Even Dragon Ball and Spongebob are looking like fun games, though I don´t care for the license at all. You see, what´s truly ingenious (and totally revolutionary) about the Wii is that the very control or input method is fun already.
Perhaps Eye Toy for PS2 is a valid comparison. It is just inherently fun to control a game with your body as opposed to pressing buttons. But Eye Toy only offered two dimensions, which made the appeal die down rather soon (because almost all games essentially boiled down to frantically waving your arms, since the camera could not pick up the more subtle movements). Wii goes far beyond that.
That´s why I played that silly shooting range level in Red Steel in early April for an hour, even though I quickly knew where those enemies would pop up. It was just inherently fun.
I see ABSOLUTLEY NOTHING revolutionary about this console what so ever.
That´s a total shame, I am sorry to hear that. But if you don´t consider the Wii revolutionary at all, then you don´t consider anything revolutionary in this field. Because I believe the NES offered no more change than Wii is heralding. The original PlayStation certainly offered less change from previous platforms. How can you say that? If this isn´t a gaming revolution, then what is? Well, you specified that:
THE ONLY WAY THAT NINTENDO WII WILL BE A TRUE 'REVOLUTIONARY' VIDEO GAME SYSTEM IS BY: (...)
The wii is able to create the illusion of next gen graphics by using shortcut methods and techniques recently patented by nintendo.
That´s it? You just want looks on par with Xbox360 and you´ll call the system revolutionary? What´s revolutionary about that? Remember, what goes on inside the console - whether it´s got massively beefed up hardware but uses it ineffectively or whether it has less hardware power but maximizes its use - that´s totally irrelevant to the consumer. The only way that shows up to the gamer is by virtue of the price tag, which is an important factor, but has nothing to do with how revolutionary a system is. So I think you should rethink your opinion on what you consider revolutionary or not.
Concerning your second point, AR and the likes, there´s no disagreement. That would be even more revolutionary, no doubt about that.
Also, how the hell is nintendo going to release 40 games at the day of launch? Are they going to be original games? Or more like 6 original games for Wii pluse 34 virtual console games?
At E3, there were 27 games playable on the showfloor (not counting behind-closed-doors presentations and Virtual Console games) and all of those looked very polished to me. They certainly could be launch titles. Since then, plenty more launch titles have been announced (just take Ubi Soft´s huge launch library of seven games, for example). They can easily have 25 - 30 games out (noone ever mentioned 40 and that is unlikely), which will be one of the strongest launch line-ups ever.
I am getting really sick of nintendo pr's and all the other employees using DS constantly when they are suppose to talk about the Wii.
Turning back to this earlier comment of yours: Nintendo is very happy to talk about Wii. At E3, I spoke to Iwata for about twenty minutes and he never mentioned the DS once. However, there are also good reasons to mention the DS in this discussion. The DS truly was the testing ground for Wii. Nintendo must have thought if the DS can succeed against the PSP, the Wii can more than hold its own against PS3 or Xbox360 - and it will.
Take something like Trauma Center for DS. Or Pac-Pix (a much underrated DS game, I believe). These games are only made possible by the console´s unique input method. There will be a Trauma Center for Wii and, if you think about it this way, the control method will be quite similar. Only that the Wii allows for richer experiences, since it allows depth. So I think it´s perfectly plausible to compare the Wii to the DS. But no, Nintendo doesn´t labour this point, at all.
Hi Anonymous.
No, the above poster is not speaking about Full Motion Video, but about the patent entitled Video game play using panoramically-composited depth-mapped cube mapping´.
yes. my "lala" land started in 1975.
When di yours? ;)
/silver
...dude please read this before you fill this blog full with shit from your mouth.
/silver
"...Many of us have seen films containing remarkably realistic dinosaurs, aliens, animated toys and other fanciful creatures. Such animations are made possible by computer graphics."
"...Because computer graphics generation is complex, computer-generated three-dimensional (3D) graphics just a few years ago were mostly limited to expensive specialized flight simulators, high-end graphics workstations and supercomputers. The public saw some of the images generated by these computer systems in movies and expensive television advertisements, but most couldn't actually interact with the computers doing the graphics generation."
"...It is now possible to interact with exciting 3D animations and simulations on relatively inexpensive computer graphics systems in home or office."
--> Nixon & Vanderhye / Nintendo [PATENT] # 20060094500, Field in May 4, 2006
"Because computer graphics generation is complex, computer-generated three-dimensional (3D) graphics just a few years ago were mostly limited to expensive specialized flight simulators, high-end graphics workstations and supercomputers. The public saw some of the images generated by these computer systems in movies and expensive television advertisements, but most couldn't actually interact with the computers doing the graphics generation"
This is sloganeering found in all gamecube based technology patents. Do a search for nintendo patents and check anything based on any of the gamecube hard and you'll see these exact words under the claims.
This patent, whatever it is, is based on gamecube hardware.
yes you're right. But as stated by Nintendo. Wii is just an extension of GameCube. 2-3 times more powerfull right?
I mean the both GC RMT's "Flipper" and "Gekko" the based to/for "Broadway" and I think that this "system 50" mentioned in many patens from them might just it.
/silver :)
Hmmm, wasn't the original Xbox CPU clocked at 733 MHz , that means the Wii (according to these alleged spec's) has less proccesing power.
Although the xbox didn't use a powerpc CPU like wii which actually performs much better.
But the GPU is much more important for the looks of a game, the alleged 243 Mhz is slower than the xbox its 250MHz GPU although it probably has acces to newer options like pixelshading.
So this meaning that the Wii (using newer technology) looks only slightly better.
Looking at Tony Hawk Downhill Jam (which looks terrible, even worse than many xbox games), this could be true.
I sure don't hope so, but it could be true...
hi Fedboy.
yeah, I think also that the CPU that's in the Wii will be like the Xobox's one. Worst of all I even suspect it to be more or less that same as the "Flipper" GameCube's but with a modifications.
But! As you might already know is that GPU's since ATI's 9700 have become more powerfull then the actually CPU itself.
My take on this is that Wii will bost either an CPU-less with highly customiced GPU that will handle huge amount of data streams.
or an Wii with CPU-onboard the Hollywood itself, er..I mean the card.
and that graphics vise, Wii will rock the boat! ..in Standarn Definition.
/silver
Making a game in HD cost a huge amount of extra processing power, the Wii won't be needing this.
The actual CPU won't make huge difference (a console is not really comparable with a pc in terms of CPU-power, because a Pc always runs an OS (XP par éxample) and loads of other programmes at the same, which can eat huge amount of proccesing power away) although my guess is that the Wii-physics won't exceed this gen's very much.
If the CPU were to be embedded in the GPU (which would be.... unique at least) would kill any delay between CPU and GPU and make it a very, very fast machine (theoreticly right?), but this is never going to happen, if only because Ati and IBM never are going to work this close.
But no chance in hell the Wii is coming anything near the PS3, if you want awesome graphics buy one of those (yes even in SD it will look loads better) and Xbox too.
Side note: My first experience with 360 wasn't a good one. It was that Rare-game. I didn't like the gameplay, I played the intro which just throws you into the game. And graphically I was like, is this it? I'm absolutly not a graphics whore but I expected it to amaze me, which it didn't even the race game afterwards (no idea which, I can't stand racers) which was about the same.
And all the games out for 360 that seem cool to me: GR:AW and oblivion (YES BOTH OF THEM!) are coming to pc.
I got a bit drifted away I see, anyway if you can't stand reasonably gfx instead of great gfx don't buy this console which enables you to play a whole new world of games.
hi again.. :)
Well I agree with you mostly of what you said.
The only thing I actually want to ask many about is - what is beutiful graphics...to you?
I have seen a demo based on a PS3 in a "Real-Time" gamepaly. And it looks great really.
But I tend to love the Wii graphics (if they becomes what I hope it tobe) more becoz it more innovative.
/silver
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